Ooof this whole thread... But I think you have a point. It's ironic that the user who's freaking out about this (and honestly needs to log off) used a Ben Shapiro emote because his argument is almost indistinguishable, frankly, from all the Islamophobic nonsense I see with respect to this issue. Maybe he should read up on some Marxists from Islamic countries or something. Ironically he complains about people abusing the world "materialism" but when it comes to this issue his idealism is clearly shining through. It's sad because this kind of discourse alienates POC, especially Muslim POC for whom this issue is used as an Islamophobic weapon. Once again hexbear never fails to amaze me in how insensitive it can be to other cultures, especially Islamic ones. I honestly worry if someone like him came into power. I know it's a meme, but he'd he "authoritarian" in a bad way...
Once again hexbear never fails to amaze me in how insensitive it can be to other cultures, especially Islamic ones. I honestly worry if someone like him came into power. I know it’s a meme, but he’d he “authoritarian” in a bad way…
Had to create an account just to say hard agree. It also kinda bugs me how so many of these westoids will unironically use the halal and haram emotes or say things like inshallah or mashallah. Like how many of these people have actually read the Quran, or even stepped foot inside a mosque? Do they know about the various schools of Sunni law and theology, not to mention with Shia or other areas of thought. Do they know anything about history?
I doubt it. It's like they're cosplaying as white saviors in the defense of Islam and Muslims, except for when it comes to things that personally bug them, in which case they immediate revert to 2000s fedora-wearing Sam Harris loving reddit atheists.
EDIT: Holy shit I just realized what that dude did. When his own source basically disproved what he was saying he replied with this:
I used a deliberately “generous” source that still admits that the event happened. I could have used a much more incendiary one, but I didn’t.
I don't know how to read that except as "I could have used a super Islamophobic and hateful source but I didn't." Dude this is like when a white person says to a black person "hey I could have called you an n-word but I didn't."
Holy shit I just realized what that dude did. When his own source basically disproved what he was saying he replied with this:
I used a deliberately “generous” source that still admits that the event happened. I could have used a much more incendiary one, but I didn’t.
I don’t know how to read that except as “I could have used a super Islamophobic and hateful source but I didn’t.” Dude this is like when a white person says to a black person “hey I could have called you an n-word but I didn’t.”
Oh jeez I didn't even realize that. Yeah that's pretty bad, IMO.
I'm more bothered by it because it's pseudo-marxism for pseudo-intellectuals and it gains purchase online because few others know better because studying marxism by yourself is a pain in the ass, so we have a glut of these fucking morons who shit up so many discussions with "you're being idealist if you don't want people fucking children and waving the flag" or whatever regressive act they're trying to defend/falsely proletarianize.
So, the Prophet’s marriage to Ayesha was nothing out of the ordinary for the time in which this marriage took place. Insisting on 21st century (Western) ideas on morality and marriage, which evolved in their own right, for a very different time and place is an ahistorical approach.
That's also a historical thing that needs to be looked at in it's cultural and historical context, which is the historical materialist way to analyze it tbh. We can't use "presentism" when looking at things in the past:
Just wanted to say you're right. "Culturally accepted" might help a person understand something, but it in no way excuses that thing. The whole modern conception of consent exists precisely because several generations of feminists critiqued what was culturally accepted until mainstream society finally realized that they were tacitly allowing some disgusting shit to happen and turned against it.
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Ooof this whole thread... But I think you have a point. It's ironic that the user who's freaking out about this (and honestly needs to log off) used a Ben Shapiro emote because his argument is almost indistinguishable, frankly, from all the Islamophobic nonsense I see with respect to this issue. Maybe he should read up on some Marxists from Islamic countries or something. Ironically he complains about people abusing the world "materialism" but when it comes to this issue his idealism is clearly shining through. It's sad because this kind of discourse alienates POC, especially Muslim POC for whom this issue is used as an Islamophobic weapon. Once again hexbear never fails to amaze me in how insensitive it can be to other cultures, especially Islamic ones. I honestly worry if someone like him came into power. I know it's a meme, but he'd he "authoritarian" in a bad way...
Had to create an account just to say hard agree. It also kinda bugs me how so many of these westoids will unironically use the halal and haram emotes or say things like inshallah or mashallah. Like how many of these people have actually read the Quran, or even stepped foot inside a mosque? Do they know about the various schools of Sunni law and theology, not to mention with Shia or other areas of thought. Do they know anything about history?
I doubt it. It's like they're cosplaying as white saviors in the defense of Islam and Muslims, except for when it comes to things that personally bug them, in which case they immediate revert to 2000s fedora-wearing Sam Harris loving reddit atheists.
EDIT: Holy shit I just realized what that dude did. When his own source basically disproved what he was saying he replied with this:
I don't know how to read that except as "I could have used a super Islamophobic and hateful source but I didn't." Dude this is like when a white person says to a black person "hey I could have called you an n-word but I didn't."
Oh jeez I didn't even realize that. Yeah that's pretty bad, IMO.
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Whatever you say man, but I no longer wish to discuss this.
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why is this the hill you die on, weirdo
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I do really hate the pseudos who are "you're idealist, I'm actually being so materialist right now" so critical support to you.
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I'm more bothered by it because it's pseudo-marxism for pseudo-intellectuals and it gains purchase online because few others know better because studying marxism by yourself is a pain in the ass, so we have a glut of these fucking morons who shit up so many discussions with "you're being idealist if you don't want people fucking children and waving the flag" or whatever regressive act they're trying to defend/falsely proletarianize.
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I mean biden did say "between adults" so I'm gonna interpret it charitably.
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Your own source says this:
https://islamfyi.princeton.edu/is-it-true-that-muhammad-married-a-child-bride-by-the-name-of-ayesha-when-he-was-53-and-she-was-9-years-old-if-so-how-do-muslims-justify-this-from-their-exemplary-prophet/
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I didn't deny it, I just pointed out that even in that case it's still ahistorical to apply our modern standards to it, which even your source admits.
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I thought you wanted to disengage?
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That's also a historical thing that needs to be looked at in it's cultural and historical context, which is the historical materialist way to analyze it tbh. We can't use "presentism" when looking at things in the past:
https://yaqeeninstitute.org/read/paper/understanding-aishas-age-an-interdisciplinary-approach
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Ok
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Just wanted to say you're right. "Culturally accepted" might help a person understand something, but it in no way excuses that thing. The whole modern conception of consent exists precisely because several generations of feminists critiqued what was culturally accepted until mainstream society finally realized that they were tacitly allowing some disgusting shit to happen and turned against it.
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