Like damn the dude and most of his family were killed in a mass shooting, did you really need to orientalize him on the way out?
:rat-salute: Here's hoping they don't end up like :pete: or :volcel-kamala:
When their was a mass shooting at my university the first NYT article about it was about how it made the university look bad. It was also definitely pre written with a little blurb about the shooting at the start.
Not sure anyone could survive such reoccurring overwhelming grief. If you're not at least somewhat numb you'd just be crying with the curtains closed
Edit: I don't want to contribute to a shitty atmosphere so comment removed, I was upset, just don't be a dick, don't shout over marginalized comrades, it's really not that hard
Of all the things I didn't expect today, I expected being told I don't understand words because I don't read the New Yorker on Hexbear the least.
Thanks for saying this. Thought I was going mad for a while seeing this kind of thing on Hexbear.
Since you asked nicely I'll respond, the modlog already says it well enough:
inappropriate. talking over / arguing with a marginalized person about their lived experience.
Basically OP picked up on a (relatively inoffensive) stereotype that's consistent with the way that east Asian people are essentialized in western news media, you came in being like wtf are you talking about (understandable), they gave what I thought was a reasonable explanation but instead of you know, absorbing it and trying to see it from their point of view you doubled down and decided to argue with them, questioned their literacy and (ironically) made them out to be ignorant.
Thing is, words have denotative and connotative meaning and they were describing connotations. Other people picked up on those connotations right away so that should tell you it's a learning opportunity rather than a reason to lecture someone, the way you argued with them was indistinguishable (imo) from crypto-racist dickheads arguing in bad faith, but judging by how you've followed up I've gathered it's in good faith. Idk dude, I hope this helps because it seems like a blind spot and I don't mean that unkindly.
Best possible explanation I can give while at work, but hope that all made sense. Peace comrade.
Might be a diaspora Asian thing. A lot of boba-liberals are really invested in depicting Asian men as being particularly patriarchal for whatever reason. If you are unfortunate enough to come into contact with incel and sexpat spaces, it is an extremely common trope for them to want to "save" Asian women from "the patriarchy" (I.e. Asian men).
I'm not denying that there are patriarchal aspects in many Asian cultures, but there's a concerted effort in the West to make Asian men sound like we're stuck in the Qing dynasty.
f you are unfortunate enough to come into contact with incel and sexpat spaces, it is an extremely common trope for them to want to “save” Asian women from “the patriarchy” (I.e. Asian men).
everyday i learn something new and everyday i thank the gods that most ppl do not use the internet in the way i do :agony-shivering:
"I'm visiting <Asian country>, maybe I should check out the <country> subreddit for information on where to go and what to ea... oh. Oh no. Oh no no no no no no."
I think one key commonality that most of the examples you linked to is that the person in question is a powerful/wealthy male. While I get where you're coming from, I still think it's deeply sus to use that word in this context.
"I'm sorry black person, I just assumed that you haven't consumed much media in which 'monkey' is a fun or positive word. 'Fun like a barrel of monkeys', the Monkees, 'monkeying around' and Curious George are all examples of positive use of the term.
Therefore, when the writer of the article said 'George Floyd is a monkey he actually meant..."
If my response seems hostile to you, have you asked yourself why an Asian person might respond in a way that seems hostile to "well you and all the other Asians just don't understand words"? Might this be shit that's pulled out regularly by westoids to dismiss and minimize the concerns of Asian people living in the West, regardless of their level of English comprehension.
I shouldn't need to explain to you that words can be contextually offensive when applied to certain groups of people. If someone published an article calling a grown black man "boy", it proves nothing to show me articles where young men of other races have been called "boy".
I am not making any statements that “minimize the concerns of Asian people living in the West, regardless of their level of English comprehension” or making any statements about “their level of English comprehension” just bc you and people on twitter don’t do crosswords and read a lot of literature / the new yorker does not mean that that
Wow.
Who do I talk to about making this one of the site headings? Because...
Wow.
If you go back and read my responses to you, I began with an explanation of my position. Then the next post said "I see where you're coming from but I think it's deeply sus in this context". In both cases you just doubled down on your position that I just don't understand the word because I don't do crosswords or whatever.
Edit: The disengage part of above user's reply was not there when I started writing this comment. Mods, please feel free to remove this if you think it's appropriate.
You can respond to this and disregard the previous disengage
No thank you. Have a good day.
Well yeah, so do you think the tweet author talked to the victim's friends and family and they all agreed that he was the head of the family and authority figure, or do you think that the writer just assumed that he's the head of the family because he's a dude and Asian?
Like what if he was really progressive and listened to his wife on everything and only did things by consensus? What if his household was actually like many "traditional" East Asian households and his wife controlled all the finances and had final say on all family matters?
Just a weird as fuck assumption to make about a shooting victim.
it means male head of the family. A woman in the same position would be a matriarch and English doesn't have a gender neutral word for head of the family.
If you are unfortunate enough to come into contact with incel and sexpat spaces, it is an extremely common trope for them to want to “save” Asian women from “the patriarchy” (I.e. Asian men)
:visible-disgust: Every day I come in to contact with new and horrible ideas.
I think they're referring to him being noted as a taekwondo master. Which, I dunno, seems like a notable thing to mention in humanizing a victim to me.
I don't know if it is orientalist but at the very least it is normalizing patriarchy so I agree the word father should be used instead.
Patriarch is a really weird term because you're either talking specifically about patriarchy, or you are talking about organizations like the mob. China had it's feudal clans. Calling a guy who was just a father "The clan head" would be really fucking weird and is ascribing feudal structures to a normal Asian family. Calling a normal Italian man who died a patriarch would be weird for the same reason.
I don't know I've seen white guys be referred to as patriarchs although normally financial control over family affairs is implied
and please just read it before you make any conclusions the title in the tweet isnt even the real title of the article, it is just the title of the tweet the article itself is nothing, but sympathetic and I can not find anything pushing any harmful steriotypes in it
I don't think the author was malicious. This wasn't the NYPost.
But the fixation on the father, with the mother and children included almost as an afterthought, combined with the immediate focus on being a Tae Kwon Do instructor first and foremost, rather than a lawyer or a father, is just... it reads like it was written by an extremely white liberal who just grinds out special interest pieces for other white liberals.
It's got fucked vibes. The language, the focus, the "thoughts and prayers" energy of the whole thing... they even have a line about the family's GoFundMe campaign ffs. Absolutely toxic. I hate that I have to live in a country that considers this sterile archetypical low-key orientalist eulogy the best kind of journalism a major media center can turn out.
And God-for-fucking-bid it include any kind of Call to Action. Its an awful way to mourn an awful event that happens an awful lot.
Was the shooter really a Nazi? We may never know.
Should we characterize Kyu Cho as a patriarch? Of course!
Man dies, almong with other non-Man and tiny-Man. Nation mourns Man's loss. Also, Tae-Kwon-Do because... you know.
between this thread and the therapist one, it feels like we're having a half-strangled struggle session on how much we really hate white people with a bunch of rubberneckers on the sidelines
vibes are off, maybe it's a timezone thing
Okay maybe you're right, my comment was sort of ass and maybe deserves to be removed but the point is the people in this thread who share the victims' race knew intuitively what OP was talking about right away and then some fuckin dude just sits there and argues as if they're completely blind to the context of racialized stereotypes and the ambient atmosphere of dehumanizing imperialist, warmongering propaganda. Can't help but notice it's the same people who get really fuckin weird about Asian people and Asian countries on this site.
Im not Asian but I knew exactly what OP was talking about the moment it was pointed out. I was wondering if this was just a thing the average minority would pick up on from living in this cursed place but as you point out it seems to just be a few people who keep doubling down. :anti-cracker-aktion:
nah nah ur cool
not sure if theyre the same people but we def got some sus takes flying around for sure
Thank you I appreciate it. Scared up some lurking reactionaries by posting that ass comment anyway
Sorry chief i just eanted to tell a funny story but everyone go angry
Nah there's a lot of :grillman: on here who can understand context. Whiteness as a social construct is inherently oppressive, and destroying the concept culturally is important. I am white, I am within that construct, and I'm fully in support of pissing on it. "My people" are the workers of the world, not white people. Because I'm a fuckin communist. You're right about one thing though, you're in the wrong space
Honestly dude only a fascist would have that mindset. You think communism is going to lead to white genocide? You think killing a social construct is the same thing as killing living breathing human beings?
Equating whiteness with Jewishness here is also super fashy and once again shows you have no grasp of context. "Jewish" is a distinct ethnicity with a history of extreme violence perpetrated against them. Whiteness is a nebulous identity that no self-respecting human uses to self identity with unless they're doing it ironically, self-depreciatingly, or because they're a klan member. And, importantly, "white" signifies a social dominance whereas Jewishness signified "the other" in your dumb comparison.
