"No one in Libya is happy with Gadaffi. He's more than a bit shit. He's garbage" - some Libyan protestor, circa 2011
I think a problem a lot of people have is that they can't imagine how worse things can get.
The NED would watch the entire country of Thailand burn (as they did so many South American countries/Middle east/Africa/Ukraine) if it meant hindering China for even a minute
It's not about resources it's about the Great Game
Thailand is buying Chinese not American military hardware, doing military exercises with Beijing and is a key partner in the BRI initiative with a China-Laos-Thailand-Malaysia-Singapore high-speed rail link that will only further cement these ties.
Which will inevitably mean at some point Thailand will kick out those US military bases and black site CIA torture camps
Thailand is little more than fair game for a proxy war for US against China
It already has - the 2 billionaires tied to Wallstreet finance and the "student led" protests funded by the CIA.
This is the same playbook CIA does since the first colour revolution in Hungary 1956. You saw the exact same thing happen in Hong Kong - a load of CIA/NED funded "student leaders" who use violence and rioting to further their agenda who then aim to incite police violence on the protestors which would then be used as propaganda to topple the regime
You want to see this in action look no further than TIannenmen protests which started because the CIA had a mole inside the Communist Party and Deng Xiao Peng was sick and student leader Chai Ling stating she won't go to the protests that day as she's hoping for the government to massacre the students
You the chinese are not worth my struggle you are not worth my sacrifice.
The students keep asking what shall we do next? I feel so sad. Becuase how can I tell them we are hoping for bloodshed? Because for the moment the government has no choice but to brazenly butcher the people. Only when the square is awash with blood will the people of China open their eys. only then will they be united. How can I explain all this to my fellow students?
And what is truly sad is some students are working hard with the government to prevent it taking such measures. For the sake of their selfish interests
they are trying to get us out of the square before the government becomes so desperate it takes action. If we allow the movement to collapse on its own then the government will be able to wipe out the leaders of the movement as well as those in the party and military
That's why I feel so sad I can't tell my fellow students straight out we must use our blood and lives to rise up. Of course the students will be willing but they are still such young children
Are you going to stay in the square yourself?
No I won't
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5__ESiklA1A
Why didn't Chai Ling go to the protests and why weren't the Chinese worth her sacrifice? Because the US had already given her a green card
If the US could get their man into Thailand and keep relations pro US for a few years they'd call that a win. If they can't they'd be happy to see Thailand burnt to the ground like Libya, Syria or Ukraine
Hong Kong would be the most recent one which is following the exact same pattern as Thailand right now. Where student leaders were funded by CIA, were seen collaborating with US deep state people, funded in collaboration with billionaires like Jimmy Lai (who literally called for US and CIA intervention...yes he literally said CIA intervention lol) who were incredibly violent toward police and mainland Chinese people that showed patriotism to PRC or did such innocuous things as hold a Chinese flag and say that "China is one"
In early June, Nicaragua’s leading young activists went on a junket to Washington, DC, on the dime of the US government-funded right-wing advocacy group Freedom House. The Nicaraguan student leaders were there to beseech Donald Trump and other right-wing US government officials to help them in their fight against Nicaraguan President Daniel Ortega.
A month before the student protesters’ meetings with ultra-conservative lawmakers in Washington, a publication funded by the US government’s regime change arm, the National Endowment for Democracy (NED), bluntly asserted that organizations backed by the NED have spent years and millions of dollars “laying the groundwork for insurrection” in Nicaragua.
Hungary 1956 was not nearly a colour revolution. No one of those kids wanted anything to do with capitalism. Rightists today still hold a grudge against the US because "they didn't come to help."
Yes it was - I can't believe how often I have to say this in left circles. It's like y'all motherfuckers read one trotskyist opportunist rag telling you "these people were the real communists against the evil baddie Soviets fighting for 'real' Socialism!" and go "yeah that sounds about right" meanwhile the bourgeois press confirmed decades ago what the Soviets and Enver Hoxha had been saying for half a century
Some of the rebels who took on the Soviet Union in the Hungarian uprising, 40 years ago this week, were trained by the British Secret Intelligence Service (SIS)
Some of the weapons used were American, and others almost certainly British. Mr Smith says MI6 and the CIA had buried arms caches in the woods around Prague and Budapest for use by "stay-behind" parties or fifth columnists in case of war.
The name of Mr Smith's main contact - a military officer working for MI6 - has been withheld under a D-notice. However, he recalled "picking up agents on the Hungarian border" to take them across in to the British-occupied zone of Austria in 1954. "We were taking them up into the mountains and giving them a sort of ... crash course. I would be told to pick somebody up from a street corner at a certain time of night in the pouring rain. Graz was our staging point. Then, after we'd trained them - explosives, weapons training - I used to take them back ... We were training the agents for the uprising."
In return, the British received information. Paul Gorka was one of a group of students recruited in the early 1950s to gather intelligence on Soviet activity in Hungary. "In due course we received coded messages from Vienna asking us for information about Russian troop movements ... We replied with information written in invisible ink in innocuous letters to special addresses."
Hungary was a fascist state for 25 years prior to Soviet occupation. The protests were quickly coopted by fascist elements who began marking doors of communists and jews for pogroms
Please read this book in full so I can stop being the lone voice in online left circles pointing out how fascist elements supported by Britain and US took over the movement
Boy is this a simplistic reading of hungarian history.
Hungary was a fascist state for 25 years prior to Soviet occupation.
True, a lot of communists were imprisoned that time, who were pardoned by Nagy, appointed by the Soviet Union, who the "coopted fascist rebels" wanted to get back into power.
"Some of the rebels who took on the Soviet Union in the Hungarian uprising, 40 years ago this week, were trained by the British Secret Intelligence Service (SIS)
Some of the weapons used were American, and others almost certainly British. Mr Smith says MI6 and the CIA had buried arms caches in the woods around Prague and Budapest for use by “stay-behind” parties or fifth columnists in case of war."
Yes, SOME of them were, but not all of them, not nearly the most of them and there was active resistance in the movement against fascistic elements.
Even the book you posted acknowledges that the reasons for the revolutions were legit FFS. The CIA never took over the movement and it was never an anticommunist movement in essence. It didn't matter however because the tanks came and murdered everyone indiscriminately.
Even the book you posted acknowledges that the reasons for the revolutions were legit FFS.
If you've read literally anything I've posted in this thread you'll see my take on Colour Revolutions - that they're very problematic as there's usually a legitimate reason to protest.
Doesn't detract from the fact that the Hungarian COlour Revolution was quickly coopted by fascistic elements armed and supported by UK and US
Yes, SOME of them were, but not all of them, not nearly the most of them and there was active resistance in the movement against fascistic elements.
Thats literally what a colour revolution is - taking over of an original movement.
it was never an anticommunist movement in essence.
Except for all the fascists marking the homes of the doors Communists and Jews during the protests when they thought they were gaining momentum and would topple the government there
It didn’t matter however because the tanks came and murdered everyone indiscriminately.
Too fucking right. Oh boo hoo you ended up on the side of counter revolution cos you couldn't discern the class forces at work and just wanted to build 'rEaL sOcIaLiSm" without the class struggle or struggle against imperialism? Get fucked
Bonus: "Not of an anticommunist nature" lol my arse. They lynched jews and communists, dragged them through the streets, spit on their bodies and burned pictures of Lenin and Stalin because "actually they were true Communists" and also stopped to have their picture taken with an American (CIA)
This "true" socialism sounds really cool and good. Also TIME magazine had them on their front cover as "freedom fighters" the same way they did for the Muhjadeen. I didn't realise TIME magazine were interested in promoting anti-Revisionist Communists. That's really cool and good I'll get a subscription to the beautiful anti-revisionist Communist TIME magazine
Me: The Hungarian revolution was far more complex than you think, there was constant infighting between the right wing elements who tried, but couldn't coopt the movement, and the left wing elements, who had legitimate grievances and while there were atrocities, the main object of the mass movement was not to overthrow communism, they explicitly stated that, the right wingers weren't even allowed in the meetings of the protesters, it's all well documented in local sources.
You, an intellectual Marxist theory reader: They were in time so they're bad *barfs a thirdhand source calling the "leader" of the revolution (hint: there wasn't one) a fascist despite he was actively pushing for socialist policies like pardoning communists jailed by the previous fascist state his predecessor couldn't be assed to do that, a fascist.
"No one in Libya is happy with Gadaffi. He's more than a bit shit. He's garbage" - some Libyan protestor, circa 2011
I think a problem a lot of people have is that they can't imagine how worse things can get.
The NED would watch the entire country of Thailand burn (as they did so many South American countries/Middle east/Africa/Ukraine) if it meant hindering China for even a minute
Yeah well the Monarchy should pull its head out of its ass than. But they are to worried about being trad Thai.
Also what resources do they have that the USA wants?
It's not about resources it's about the Great Game
Thailand is buying Chinese not American military hardware, doing military exercises with Beijing and is a key partner in the BRI initiative with a China-Laos-Thailand-Malaysia-Singapore high-speed rail link that will only further cement these ties.
Which will inevitably mean at some point Thailand will kick out those US military bases and black site CIA torture camps
Thailand is little more than fair game for a proxy war for US against China
So where will this proxy war start?
Libya Syria Ukraine you have different cultures to go against each other pretty easily.
Where does it happen in Thailand?
Where does the proxy war start?
It already has - the 2 billionaires tied to Wallstreet finance and the "student led" protests funded by the CIA.
This is the same playbook CIA does since the first colour revolution in Hungary 1956. You saw the exact same thing happen in Hong Kong - a load of CIA/NED funded "student leaders" who use violence and rioting to further their agenda who then aim to incite police violence on the protestors which would then be used as propaganda to topple the regime
You want to see this in action look no further than TIannenmen protests which started because the CIA had a mole inside the Communist Party and Deng Xiao Peng was sick and student leader Chai Ling stating she won't go to the protests that day as she's hoping for the government to massacre the students
Are you going to stay in the square yourself?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5__ESiklA1A
Why didn't Chai Ling go to the protests and why weren't the Chinese worth her sacrifice? Because the US had already given her a green card
If the US could get their man into Thailand and keep relations pro US for a few years they'd call that a win. If they can't they'd be happy to see Thailand burnt to the ground like Libya, Syria or Ukraine
Either they'd consider a win
Show me some modern examples that worked liked this.
Hong Kong would be the most recent one which is following the exact same pattern as Thailand right now. Where student leaders were funded by CIA, were seen collaborating with US deep state people, funded in collaboration with billionaires like Jimmy Lai (who literally called for US and CIA intervention...yes he literally said CIA intervention lol) who were incredibly violent toward police and mainland Chinese people that showed patriotism to PRC or did such innocuous things as hold a Chinese flag and say that "China is one"
https://www.mintpressnews.com/hong-kong-protest-united-states-destabilize-china/261712/
Also Nicaragua
https://popularresistance.org/ned-boasts-of-laying-the-groundwork-for-nicaraguan-insurrection/
Once again. Hk sees it self differnt from China, so you can exploit that easily. And it still didn't lead to Anything becuase it was mostly peaceful
Thai people like certain aspects of the Monarchy. I guess it could get rowdy. But from students I don't know.
It's encouraging that you think Thai society has no rivets that the US can stick a crowbar in
The CIA has put their money where their mouth is and poured millions into destabilising Thai society so hopefully you're correct
dude........
?
Hungary 1956 was not nearly a colour revolution. No one of those kids wanted anything to do with capitalism. Rightists today still hold a grudge against the US because "they didn't come to help."
Yes it was - I can't believe how often I have to say this in left circles. It's like y'all motherfuckers read one trotskyist opportunist rag telling you "these people were the real communists against the evil baddie Soviets fighting for 'real' Socialism!" and go "yeah that sounds about right" meanwhile the bourgeois press confirmed decades ago what the Soviets and Enver Hoxha had been saying for half a century
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/mi6-trained-rebels-to-fight-soviets-in-hungarian-revolt-1359599.html
Hungary was a fascist state for 25 years prior to Soviet occupation. The protests were quickly coopted by fascist elements who began marking doors of communists and jews for pogroms
https://espressostalinist.com/2011/11/29/the-fascist-hungarian-counterrevolution-of-1956/
Please read this book in full so I can stop being the lone voice in online left circles pointing out how fascist elements supported by Britain and US took over the movement
https://www.espressostalinist.files.wordpress.com/2010/12/the-truth-about-hungary.pdf
Boy is this a simplistic reading of hungarian history.
True, a lot of communists were imprisoned that time, who were pardoned by Nagy, appointed by the Soviet Union, who the "coopted fascist rebels" wanted to get back into power.
"Some of the rebels who took on the Soviet Union in the Hungarian uprising, 40 years ago this week, were trained by the British Secret Intelligence Service (SIS)
Some of the weapons used were American, and others almost certainly British. Mr Smith says MI6 and the CIA had buried arms caches in the woods around Prague and Budapest for use by “stay-behind” parties or fifth columnists in case of war."
Yes, SOME of them were, but not all of them, not nearly the most of them and there was active resistance in the movement against fascistic elements.
Even the book you posted acknowledges that the reasons for the revolutions were legit FFS. The CIA never took over the movement and it was never an anticommunist movement in essence. It didn't matter however because the tanks came and murdered everyone indiscriminately.
If you've read literally anything I've posted in this thread you'll see my take on Colour Revolutions - that they're very problematic as there's usually a legitimate reason to protest.
Doesn't detract from the fact that the Hungarian COlour Revolution was quickly coopted by fascistic elements armed and supported by UK and US
Thats literally what a colour revolution is - taking over of an original movement.
Except for all the fascists marking the homes of the doors Communists and Jews during the protests when they thought they were gaining momentum and would topple the government there
Too fucking right. Oh boo hoo you ended up on the side of counter revolution cos you couldn't discern the class forces at work and just wanted to build 'rEaL sOcIaLiSm" without the class struggle or struggle against imperialism? Get fucked
Bonus: "Not of an anticommunist nature" lol my arse. They lynched jews and communists, dragged them through the streets, spit on their bodies and burned pictures of Lenin and Stalin because "actually they were true Communists" and also stopped to have their picture taken with an American (CIA)
This "true" socialism sounds really cool and good. Also TIME magazine had them on their front cover as "freedom fighters" the same way they did for the Muhjadeen. I didn't realise TIME magazine were interested in promoting anti-Revisionist Communists. That's really cool and good I'll get a subscription to the beautiful anti-revisionist Communist TIME magazine
https://imgur.com/a/1wda0
https://imgur.com/a/kXzat
Me: The Hungarian revolution was far more complex than you think, there was constant infighting between the right wing elements who tried, but couldn't coopt the movement, and the left wing elements, who had legitimate grievances and while there were atrocities, the main object of the mass movement was not to overthrow communism, they explicitly stated that, the right wingers weren't even allowed in the meetings of the protesters, it's all well documented in local sources.
You, an intellectual Marxist theory reader: They were in time so they're bad *barfs a thirdhand source calling the "leader" of the revolution (hint: there wasn't one) a fascist despite he was actively pushing for socialist policies like pardoning communists jailed by the previous fascist state his predecessor couldn't be assed to do that, a fascist.
lol "didnt come to help" their pogroms, boo hoo.
I didn't say they're right.
Wording kinda got me, i feel ya now.