No point in trying. material conditions don't matter, the inability of the government doesn't matter, the nature of pandemic politics don't matter. It's hopeless, fuck me for suggesting it's not.
I'm not saying it's hopeless, man. I'm saying this is a good time for radicalization but a bit too early to jump the gun on radical action. Especially like right now. Cops AND CHUDs would be blasting our asses if we tried anything. Doesn't mean all hope is lost.
I'm not following your line. Pina seems to be arguing that these protestors are a wing of the status quo and not in fact radicals. They only got as far as they did because they faced 0 resistance and needed portapotties and a corndog stand present to carry out this action. There were only a few thousand at most and no other protests outside of DC.
This isn't some mass movement, it was a carefully planned and organized event. For contrast, look at the summer protests. Hundreds of thousands marching in every urban center or America. Thousands camping out for days outside the White House. More solidarity protests in cities around the world. That's the radical power we have on our side. We don't need shitters and corndogs.
Still pretty isolated events for the most part. They only faced a violent police force in LA I think? I mean it's terrible, but the biggest reason they're getting this far is police compliance. None of them are really resisting the police. Even in DC, they were just calmly asked to disperse with no tear gas or batons or LRAD. Their numbers aren't that massive. Like 2,000 max in a protest. Even my small town was still having gatherings larger than that 2 weeks into the George Floyd protests.
They don't even know what to do when they get into these places. Some people planted bombs, some people just took selfies, some just started shooting at other protestors. It's just moronic. They aren't organized, they're just going places and standing around for the most part. That's why they needed the food stands, they'd just leave if they got hungry. There isn't any drive to change things in them. They don't have any sort of genuine ideology to organize around. The only reason they're even going out is because they know nothing will happen to them.
Taking the Capitol literally means nothing if they don’t follow it up by actually seizing power or making any demands in the process. We’re already starting to see those same people who stormed the Capitol just turn around and leave cause they never actually planned to do anything other than just walk around and be angry. Their only concrete goal is to keep Trump in power and they’ve already realized they can’t actually make that happen, at least not without genuinely threatening capital which they’re not gonna do considering they can’t even handle being pepper-sprayed, let alone getting into actual armed conflict with the state
Sigh.
Fascists take the Capitol building and this is still the line.
They literally just opened the gate dude
America is more radical than you think how much evidence do you need?
At this point "the left is too weak" is just an incredibly sad excuse.
Yeah that's why joe biden was elected president
So you're giving up for 4-8 years?
Why bother with this site at all then? What's the point? Just shut it down and vote Biden. Organize after I guess. Maybe.
Organizing and radical action is different shit dude.
You're right it's hopeless I'm sorry for bringing it up, anyone who does is a fool and I should probably just kill myself.
Good talk.
It's not hopeless it's a game of numbers. Organizing and infiltrating are different things.
Nah you were right before it's hopeless.
No point in trying. material conditions don't matter, the inability of the government doesn't matter, the nature of pandemic politics don't matter. It's hopeless, fuck me for suggesting it's not.
I'm not saying it's hopeless, man. I'm saying this is a good time for radicalization but a bit too early to jump the gun on radical action. Especially like right now. Cops AND CHUDs would be blasting our asses if we tried anything. Doesn't mean all hope is lost.
Removed by mod
I'm not following your line. Pina seems to be arguing that these protestors are a wing of the status quo and not in fact radicals. They only got as far as they did because they faced 0 resistance and needed portapotties and a corndog stand present to carry out this action. There were only a few thousand at most and no other protests outside of DC.
This isn't some mass movement, it was a carefully planned and organized event. For contrast, look at the summer protests. Hundreds of thousands marching in every urban center or America. Thousands camping out for days outside the White House. More solidarity protests in cities around the world. That's the radical power we have on our side. We don't need shitters and corndogs.
They breached the Kansas statehouse, they were trying in oregon, they managed to get through the gates of the governors mansion in washington.
Still pretty isolated events for the most part. They only faced a violent police force in LA I think? I mean it's terrible, but the biggest reason they're getting this far is police compliance. None of them are really resisting the police. Even in DC, they were just calmly asked to disperse with no tear gas or batons or LRAD. Their numbers aren't that massive. Like 2,000 max in a protest. Even my small town was still having gatherings larger than that 2 weeks into the George Floyd protests.
They don't even know what to do when they get into these places. Some people planted bombs, some people just took selfies, some just started shooting at other protestors. It's just moronic. They aren't organized, they're just going places and standing around for the most part. That's why they needed the food stands, they'd just leave if they got hungry. There isn't any drive to change things in them. They don't have any sort of genuine ideology to organize around. The only reason they're even going out is because they know nothing will happen to them.
Taking the Capitol literally means nothing if they don’t follow it up by actually seizing power or making any demands in the process. We’re already starting to see those same people who stormed the Capitol just turn around and leave cause they never actually planned to do anything other than just walk around and be angry. Their only concrete goal is to keep Trump in power and they’ve already realized they can’t actually make that happen, at least not without genuinely threatening capital which they’re not gonna do considering they can’t even handle being pepper-sprayed, let alone getting into actual armed conflict with the state