For comrades wanting to protest the war in Ukraine without fear of supporting fascists and reactionaries, there will be a rally on March 18.
EDIT: link https://www.answercoalition.org/protest_march_18_19_peace_in_ukraine_say_no_to_endless_u_s_wars
https://www.answercoalition.org/protest_march_18_19_peace_in_ukraine_say_no_to_endless_u_s_wars
how can you be a "leftist" and not be involved with or even follow any actual leftist orgs, all of which have been doing lots of anti-war organizing around this in the past year
what are the top five leftist org accomplishments in the US in the last five years?
an Iraq War level protest,
one that actually has a potential to make an impact nationwide.
yeah those iraq war protests sure did a lot
what's the point of rallies if they don't further our goals? you might as well do electoralism.
Lenin famously never did a rally or anything anti-war. What liberalism to do that!
lenin doing something doesn't mean it's the best use of our efforts 100+ years later when the capitalists have had the same amount of time in power to develop strategies to invalidate our efforts.
Iraq war protests didn't do shit, and there were americans being sent to die there. Why the fucking hell do you or anyone else think the same performance would accomplish anything this time when it's not even "our boys"?
please i beg you to explain in discrete steps the cause and effect of what this action is meant to accomplish,
Lot of words from a cushy American to justify why you don’t need to oppose the American war machine in every way
explain the mechanism of action. my contention is that performances like that aren't actually opposition, because they don't accomplish anything.
not everyone on this site lives in a nation supporting Ukraine
The western left initially took a neutral or pro-Ukraine stance broadly
From what I can tell, the only "left" group participating/promoting the Tulsi/Tucker griftfest is PCUSA, whose official Twitter is RTing Jacskon "MAGA communist" Hinkle. IOW, it's just a brown/brown alliance.
PCUSA is riddled with FBI undercovers, including leadership. Them participating is literally an op lol :fedposting:
It's so funny to me that the sex criminal LaRoucheites (CPUSA) and the non sex criminal LaRouchites (PCUSA) are both accusing each other of being FBI informants.
I would simply not be a LaRoucheite
holy shit stop shitting on communist orgs when it's vague bullshit like this. Yeah both orgs have their problems, sure as hell isn't a LaRoucheite problem.
It's not vague, there are credible SA allegations against a CPUSA member. It's also true that both orgs are accusing each other of informing to the FBI. They're both radioactive as hell.
Against one CPUSA member? I wouldn't mind reading more about this if you have more info. The Canada party had a similar issue and defended said offender, was fucked up to say the least. Whoever did so should be purged obv. Now how does that mean the party is a LaRouchite party? Both orgs are comprised of a lot of people, an org which barely practices dem cent, in no official capacity have I seen the CPUSA in recent years accuse PCUSA of being informants. Hell the party rarely talks about that (can not speak for individual chapters). They HAVE accused PCUSA of other things, just idealogical clashes usually as well for their affiliation with the patsocs(?) don't remember tbh
An entire page of PCUSA/CPUSA shit flinging
https://partyofcommunistsusa.org/12172-2/
so I read through that entire thing, where is the CPUSA? This seems entirely isolated to PCUSA and ASB, as someone who is not a member of those orgs, I can only defend the org in which I am a part of, the CPUSA. Really fucked up shit in there and very disheartening to read. I know last year the party had some info leaks due to infiltrating patsocs (who are just feds or useful idiots), some of their tactics like posting meeting info on 4chan is very similar. Except this doesn't relate to these parties being LaRouchite orgs, especially when there are amazing comrades in both orgs, trying to do good work.
By your own admission your org has been infiltrated since its inception.
An org that is currently platforming known reactionaries in Carlson/Gabbard/Hinkle.
An org which includes in its 8 principles of "unity" what amounts to an enemies list that lumps Maoists, Trots and anarchists in with petty bourgeois and capitalists.
CPUSA is literally the oldest and largest US communist org, of course it's been infiltrated. Every org worth their salt will and has been infiltrated, we have to prepare for such things and work on vetting as well as learn from the past with things such as COINTELPRO and what feds did to the older CPUSA. We have purged before and shall continue to do so, being a communist is dangerous work but that should not paralyze us from action or leaveus waiting for the "perfect" org to come around. Actively comrades seek to change and make this org better while doing mass work.
The CPUSA is not platforming any of those people and is much more likely to be platforming socdems like AOC or libs once election comes around. An issue we need to rectify. I think you might be conflating us with PCUSA(?) though I saw a comrade here from the org who could probably explain that.
Yes, they do indeed have that, now as someone who leans toward maoism I don't like this. I have spoken up about this as have others, it's something that we hope to change. Though it should be clarified, the same comrades who have made this a thing, work with these orgs/comrades on the ground if need be. Every chapter has their own experiences with local maoists and trots, some better or worse than others.
I don't care. As long as you are in an org and doing something say whatever the fuck you want. But if you say this from a keyboard and have done literally nothing to help the cause or your community, you are worse than the :lmayo: in the young democrats.
Cool, I hope you local chapter is more radical than the ones I've met.
Everyone’s org is a joke, an op, full of Feds, and going nowhere. The most important idea is that we never join any of them
Than it sounds like both parties have their issues no?
I'm not CPUSA either, they're even more infiltrated than the PCUSA is. Both those parties are filled with stuffy old boomers and feds, and are essentially decrepit and defunct today.
I wasn't trying to imply that you were, but I understand how yiu could take it that way. Sorry.
it came to me in a dream
also the reason the FBI exists to infiltrate communist organizations. My shitty dinky small town org turned out to have an FBI undercover leading it, and we weren't even technically communist. PCUSA is definitely infiltrated.
PCUSA sounds like a genuine shitshow and not worth anyone's time
To repeat what I posted in another post with 300+ fucking comments:
Unless your rally is willing enough to engage in rioting or other forms of illegalism and adventurism, then it's nothing more than a glorified parade and a recruitment drive for the orgs that organized the event. This is regardless of whether the rally is a Sanders rally or a pro-Ukraine rally or the "bad" anti-war rally or the "good" anti-war rally. The George Floyd riots were effective precisely because they were just that: riots. Not every BLM rally in 2020 became riots, but it's the threat of rioting that kept the pigs on their toes. Once the ops came in to sabotage the rallies from within as part of a counterinsurgency strategy, then the rallies became glorified parades and hence useless.
Correct. If your protest doesn't involve a threat, it's a shitty protest.
i do, i just don't put much stock in how much they actually accomplish
they're good for meeting like-minded people who have a small chance of being up for something more useful
but not much elseand I’m sad so many people here, probably due to the sheer alienation of being american, can’t even comprehend that.
Imagine, if you will, a hog with shit on it's testicles
"We will shut down this whole god damn country," is, believe it or not, a threat!
They were what? What changed? Cops never stopped killing black people people just stopped caring, police budgets got higher too.
I would say they were effective or had the potential to be effective up until the ops commandeered control over the movement and turned it into glorified parades. From a more strategic viewpoint, yes you can argue that the entire protests, even the riots, were not effective in the end. However, I see that as more an indictment against spontaneity and the skillful deployment of counterinsurgency tactics than protests themselves.
You’re saying there’s no point in protesting the war unless they invade the capitol or something? That’s insane.
How does a bunch of people meekly holding up a bunch of signs materially lead to the people of the Donbass region not being shelled by Ukrainian fascists? A whole bunch of people meekly holding up a bunch of signs didn't materially bring relieve to the people of Iraq.
I think people need to face the music and accept that anti-war protests don't work anymore, if they ever did. The complete nonfactor of the anti-war protests during the Iraq war should be a wake-up call to come up with a new anti-war strategy.
I do not agree, I've been in peaceful protest that have turned into riots here in Chile, peaceful protests can be a radicalizing moment for a lot of people, because they can see without the news filter how the pigs react. In this protest I can believe you that cops would not react because there a lot of right wingers, but if enough leftist show up, they are definitely going to do something dumb, that can radicalize baby leftist and libs into better politics.
Wonder if fash grifters will show up to this one, since they sincerely agree with these points and thats what "movements" are about :thinkin-lenin:
Their rallies were about as effective at shaping policy as Jon Stewart’s
Aren’t all rallies in the US that effective? Even our riots don’t get results. Very resilient political structure
Yeah I'm sure brown shirts will be excited to go to a non astro turfed event that doesnt include any of their favorite grifters
The first thing I’m concerned about when running a low attendance rally is keeping people out
Quite eye opening the extent of bad faith which westoids will go to to avoid doing any work or opposing their empire in any way.
Considering an Atomwaffen chud showed up to to the one today it looks more like a fed psyop to divide the left than anything.
Do you want to be part of a group with red/brown grifters, "former fascists", and their hangers on?
There are obvious agent provocateurs in that crowd today, and the FBI is well known for hiring chuds to stir up shit that they can blame on leftists.
There are folks there that can't even enter europe because they are holocaust deniers.
Yes, but the problem remains of these hangers on just appearing at the next one.
There needs to be red lines drawn because the anti-war grift is going to attract a lot of problematic grifters.
People know Matthew heimbach, and Atomwaffen, just because he’s holding a commie flag at the libertarian-Nazi love fest doesn’t mean he’ll parade around a place with actual leftists. There’s no clout associated with any of the March 18th groups, the cameras won’t be on them, and they won’t waste their time
There isn't just one fascist in the crowd...
There are speakers there that deny the holocaust ffs.
I’m a little confused, are you referring to today’s rally?
I only ask because the speakers for the March rally haven’t been released yet.
Hey look its the guy who proudly admitted he doesnt do any political action whatsoever
