Reminder of the “no sectarianism” rule. There are plenty of actual anarchists out there who aren’t terminally-online shitstirrers.

:left-unity-3:

Radlibs and feds are fair game though.

                  • doesntmatter [none/use name]
                    ·
                    2 years ago

                    USSR collapsed because of a capitulating mode of reformism. nothing was any kind of death knell for it until 1987 when it rapidly gave in to and legitimised the secondary (black/grey market) economy as well as Gorbo thinking it was in the USSR's best interests to make itself more like a "Western Democracy", among other dimwitted and ideologically incoherent (unless one is basically radlib - yes Gorbo basically became the Rad Lib King) reforms.

                    if you're into audiobooks at all please give this a listen https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LbKELtQr8iU&

            • space_comrade [he/him]
              ·
              2 years ago

              IRL anarchists are usually way better with their takes than very online anarchists.

          • ShimmeringKoi [comrade/them]
            ·
            2 years ago

            I share that criticism as an ML, which is why I consider anarchism to be the beginning and end of communism. It's the ultimate goal, and, if this makes sense, the stem cells, the DNA, the north star. Anarchists are always there to remind me what I ultimately want to build towards using state power for-to destroy the state, and all states:left-unity-2:

        • Awoo [she/her]
          ·
          2 years ago

          I hate this interpretation of MLs.

          We don't love states, that's why we're fucking communists to begin with, we want a stateless, currencyless, classless society of abundance.

          The problem is that we need a proletarian state in order to defeat the bourgeoise states in order to get ourselves into a situation where we won't be utterly fucking crushed when we try and create that kind of society. States are bad, proletarian states do bad things too, we know that, we just also see it as impossible any other way, we want to end the proletarian states as well, that's the point, but we need to end the bourgeoise states FIRST.

    • spring_rabbit [she/her]
      ·
      2 years ago

      Anarchist: opposes the state

      MLs trying not to be sectarian: "Well clearly they don't actually mean that."

      • American_Communist22 [she/her,comrade/them]
        ·
        2 years ago

        We are trying not to cause any fights, don't be like that. We also do oppose a state, we just see it as a means to an end, something to be used for protection and a base.

        • WittyProfileName2 [she/her]
          ·
          2 years ago

          We also do oppose a state, we just see it as a means to an end, something to be used for protection and a base.

          This is literally what state and rev is about isn't it?

      • happyandhappy [she/her]
        ·
        2 years ago

        ive found that anarchists and mls have conceptually distinct definitions of the state which is the crux of the pointless arguing.

        • spring_rabbit [she/her]
          ·
          2 years ago

          Nah this meme is stupid and in retrospect, even adding to this shitstorm was in poor taste. Hexbear is the best left unity site because we ignore sectarian differences and generally agree not to talk about them, and posting cringe takes from self-proclaimed anarchists is just going to lead to this largely-communist site arguing over what "real anarchists" believe.

    • BigAssBlueBug [they/them]
      ·
      2 years ago

      It's because nobody has read state and revolution so they'll just say "yeah lol w/e" to whatever shitty meme you show them and go back to doing sick skateboard tricks and spray painting walls

      • HumanBehaviorByBjork [any, undecided]
        ·
        2 years ago

        serious answer is, my conception of anarchism rejects the state as such, but it also requires of the anarchist that we be well-read. i can reject lenin without caricaturing him.

        • doesntmatter [none/use name]
          ·
          2 years ago

          this is where someone thoroughly M or L or ML or especially even MLM (which has quite a focus on thorough cultural revolution) asks genuinely, how exactly can you educate, build and hold together an anarchist society when the entire outside forces can pick you apart from any which angle through any myriad of persons and apparatuses, near purely because you have a moral/philosophical obligation to disarm yourself from the tool of state power?

          • WideningGyro [any]
            ·
            2 years ago

            Learning the extent to which the "outside forces" will fight, kill, rape and destroy any attempt at revolution played a large part in my transitioning away from anarchism to ML. When empires/global apparatuses of anti-communist violence like the US exist, I don't see any other way.