heres how I know; vietnam & australia didn't need the vaccine to do it, so whatever it is that caused the US to not be able to deal with the pandemic without the vaccine is also gonna make the US be unable to deal with the pandemic with the vaccine.
The lack of the vaccine isn't the problem, corruption is. It isn't a tech problem, it's a governance problem. The US is gonna have COVID for ever.
PS, the exact same thing applies for climate change. Ppl be like "oh climate change will be fixed once we invent the right tech". The thing is, we already have the tech to end climate change, we're just ruled by ppl who don't want to. We're fucked, and we're fucked forever, stop waiting for the ghost of albert einstein to solve your problems for you with a glass vial & recognize that anyone who tells you to is the enemy
If enough Americans refuse to get the vaccine COVID just...won't ever end in the US. Cursed.
I don't think it'll even come down to choice, I think most Americans are just never even gonna be able to get the vaccine.
It's gonna be weird when libs start shaming us for not getting vaccinated because we can't afford it
inb4 progressivism of 2021 involves popular figures acting for ads for wholesome public-good minded covid vaccination loans
Good point, I think you're right and lack of access will be more important, but that covid-truthers refusing the vaccines make it worse in a smaller but perceptible way.
It’s really starting to dawn on my how fucking annoying people who lie about having the vaccine to not wear masks and social distances are gonna be. This is setting itself up to be an interesting couple of months.
When the vaccine distribution really rolls out to everyone, as in, available at your local drug store or doctor's office, I have a funny feeling it'll be in 2022 and it'll be the Astrazeneca vaccine.
Im going to take an optimistic route. Governments are willing to spend an absolutely obscene amount of money to make their friends scalping these ps5s rich right now. Because of the immense demand the amount of ps5 production is sure to increase. Clearly there are not enough for Christmas or probably even the winter, but no one is going to stand between between them and they will never admit they backed the wrong horse and should have gone with the COVAX series one.
The Pfizer and Moderna ones are a logistical nightmare for a worldwide rollout because of how cold they have to be kept. We don't have the infrastructure for it. We don't even have the dry ice, which is the "easy" method.
The Astra Zeneca vaccine is still in trials, until the end of next year. It got suspended temporarily for unexplained illness: spinal cord swelling, which is... disconcerting. It however, works by using a genetically modified adenovirus, and doesn't have to be treated anywhere near as delicately. Normal fridge temps are fine, AFAIK. Not -70 at all times.
It got suspended temporarily for unexplained illness
Yes, but that is not the reason it's still in trials right now, the reason is that their efficacy report the first time was a complete mess, they fucked up the dosage in some trials but figured out that the "wrong" dosage seemingly produced better results so eventually they released results for the "right" dosage which demonstrated 60% efficacy, the "wrong" dosage which demonstrated 90% efficacy (but in a restricted group) and then they averaged it together to get 75% (lol).
Yeah, you're right.
I knew that Moderna's vaccine is supposed to last thirty days defrosted at fridge temp, as opposed to Pfizer's five. But I didn't realize when I wrote the comment that it didn't have to be frozen as aggressively.
Still, the Astrazeneca vaccine is supposed to be able to last six months at fridge temps.
Ah I didn't realize the Astra Zeneca vaccine was that resilient. Thanks for the explanation!
Leave then. It’s almost impossible right now, but if you want to get a job in a ‘developing’ country like Vietnam it’s not hard as an American. Get a degree, literally any degree and go get your TEFL. Congratulations you just unlocked your way into almost every ‘developing’ country on earth. Just stop teaching English as soon as you can unless that’s your dream for some reason.
You already did the hard part by getting there. You now have a new job which is learn the language and get make connections doing the things you want to do is the next goal so you don’t kill yourself doing a job you hate with probably an abusive company. You already have a degree by this point so you are more “educated” than almost every local even in countries like China. You hopefully also can learn a useful skill besides just being a foreigner during this time.
A big warning to you if your going to China, it’s a lovely place but as an individual it’s far more of an intense capitalist hustle than even the US. The difference is there is economic growth so the rising tide is lifting everyone up right now. Any sort of leftist ideas you have about it come into place on the big picture level so just be ready for that. Also getting side jobs outside of teaching English is pretty easy once you get bad at the language, but some of the nicer ones won’t be available to you if you have dark skin. Obama-black is the socially acceptable limit on those.
i'm not from the US but I'm also strongly considering going to the Chinese or Cuban consulate and asking some question about graduate degrees and immigration.
It’s almost impossible right now,
this is the part I'm talking about
I think the real problem post vaccine is gonna be the massive economic downturn coming in 2021 Q1, and the ruling class that will do absolutely fucking nothing.
We're already at that stage. The vaccine won't bring any jobs back or magically fix all of the damage.
We're pretty much headed straight to a new great depression. The government wants to push austerity instead of doing anything else that could help.
I mean you see the early signs, consumer spending is significantly down in retail during the holidays what has basically become a make or break period for all retailers. Next year it’ll be even worse as more and more bills come due and more protections start to expire. Sean from antifada also shared an article about corporations dishing corporate offices now that working from home has proven successful. We are gonna have a demand crisis and a real state crisis in the corporate sector. This is all coming due next year.
heres how I know; vietnam & australia didn’t need the vaccine to do it, so whatever it is that caused the US to not be able to deal with the pandemic without the vaccine is also gonna make the US be unable to deal with the pandemic with the vaccine.
This doesn't make sense. The only way this can make sense is if for whatever reason the US ends up not vaccinating most of the population. Same with the climate change analogy (which really isn't very good because really, we don't even have the tech to end climate change even if governments were actually trying, unless we started changing what is produced for what reason and how it is distributed.
I don't see a good reason why the US would avoid vaccinating most of the population. Apparently the first 100M doses will be free, and after that it's gonna be 20 dollars, hardly a price that would make it impossible for most (not all) in the US to buy. It just doesn't make sense why they wouldn't take the least abrasive measure possible to end the pandemic and make people confident enough to start spending again as well as avoid a major issue with workers being unable to work due to sickness and healthcare costs.
A few problems are the logistical nightmare of distributing the Pfizer vaccines. But there's also the Moderna vaccines, which don't require -70 degrees to be stored. It's still gonna be hard, but for a country like the US (as opposed to somewhere in the third world), it's not really an insurmountable hurdle, and it's gonna be more of a delay rather than a brick wall. Also bear in mind that so far it's just the US and UK that have administered many doses, it is the other countries that are lagging behind and really, the main victim here will be the third world (as always), since it is them that completely lack adequate infrastructure to administer the vaccines and power to buy them.
You can't just take completely different issues and just say "oh the outcome is gonna be exactly the same regardless of the fundamental difference between the issues". This forum has kind of an issue with very hyperbolic predictions. I'm also reminded of all the posts about the post election chaos, collapse, mass terrorism, a coup, and the stuff urging people to leave the country, when it just turned out to be... Not much different to just any other election.
The part that's gonna actually be shitty though is all the people pretending they've been vaccinated to ignore precautions.
at the current rate the US wont be vaccinated for 7 years https://nymag.com/intelligencer/article/americas-vaccine-rollout-disaster.html
we don’t even have the tech to end climate change
yes we do. What do you think green energy is?? If we invested in green energy the way we invest in fossil fuels climate change would be the thing of speculative fiction. There are already whole ass countries that are carbon neutral, kill the liberal in your head who insists that better things aren't possible & we have to just sit on our hands and wait for a scientist to invent a solution to the problem when we've had the solution for a long time & just keep electing people who don't want to solve the problem
yes we do. What do you think green energy is??
Something that doesn't instantly solve climate change, because extracting and processing all the resources required to make the switch is still extremely damaging, and will still not solve the CO2 emissions because of transportation problems.
There are already whole ass countries that are carbon neutral
Ah, yes, small and extremely rich northern European countries occasionally with the luxury of having geothermal energy, that pretend they are super green while simultaneously extract tons of oil (looking at you, Norway). For all their posturing, some of these countries (particularly Iceland and Norway) are actually very comparable to the US in terms of per capita emissions. It's really quite shitty. The green posturing of some EU countries is such a joke when they wag their fingers at countries poorer or more "evil" in the mind of Europeans than them despite the fact that they have less emissions per capita than them in the same breath.
kill the liberal in your head who insists that better things aren’t possible & we have to just sit on our hands and wait for a scientist to invent a solution to the problem
You're the one who seems to think that the solution to climate change is technological lol, the difference is that you seem to think the technology is already there, whereas the truth is that it's not here and it won't be here any time soon, if nothing changes in the overall structure of the economy and consumption patterns. I never said better things aren't possible, shifting to green energy will definitely be better and a good first step but it really isn't an end all be all solution, deeper changes have to happen.
Yeah it makes no sense. The other countries are able to handle it with staying home and wearing masks, we need a vaccine. That's the thing stopping is from fixing it. We aren't supporting people to stay home, and we're coughing on each other recreationally.
The other countries are able to handle it with staying home and wearing masks, we need a vaccine
At this point, most heavily affected countries need a vaccine. It's not just the US. Even countries that did well during the first wave fucked up during the second, and the ones that didn't fuck up during the second wave will probably fuck up during the third, or the fourth, or whatever if vaccines aren't out.
Yeah but the vaccines are apparently really effective, and most people will take it
I think more people will start taking it once they start hearing about people they personally know taking it.
The main thing some worry about is people getting the first dose, experiencing some side effects, getting spooked, and then skipping on the next dose.
I agree on climate change but disagree about the vaccine. Of course tech can't solve every problem, but vaccines are probably the best example of a case where technology can make a big difference. Like smallpox probably could've theoretically been eradicated through aggressive quarantine measures, but was instead eradicated by vaccine, because the vaccine makes things easier.
The lack of the vaccine isn’t the problem, corruption is. It isn’t a tech problem, it’s a governance problem.
It's both. Problems can have multiple causes and multiple solutions. At this point I think even an ideal government wouldn't be able to eradicate COVID in the US without a vaccine. Vietnam did well because they caught it early and took it seriously.
We are absolutely going to have covid forever. Coronavirus adaptive immunity is almost always short-lived (think 3-5 years), and to functionally eliminate a virus from a population requires something like 90% compliance.
If you don't think that the 90% of the population of the United States will concurrently be vaccinated within a 3-5 year window, which will never fucking happen, then you have to accept it as a new endemic virus. It won't be as rampant as it is now, but it'll be around forever now.
Luckily the vaccines appear to be effective and you can protect yourself and loved ones with regular doses.
I'm not saying COVID will necessarily be eradicated, but I think it will be possible to go back to normal and not keep having a 9/11 every day.
text-search this article for the sentence that contains the words "seven years" https://nymag.com/intelligencer/article/americas-vaccine-rollout-disaster.html
It's not so simple, even if that percentage of the population doesn't get vaccinated, the rest have either contracted the virus already, will contract the virus anyways after a short period of time, or spread will just completely stop due to herd immunity combined with measures. It's hard to tell for sure what will happen but diseases have been eradicated due to vaccination in the past, it may not happen immediately but it may still happen eventually. Then again, maybe it won't happen at all, but if vaccines improve to the point where distribution isn't as hard as it's been so far (and they probably will), it won't really be an issue any more. Measles is an extremely contagious disease, far more so than covid, but it was eradicated in many countries due to vaccinations. Of course one complication is that immunity from measles lasts pretty much for a lifetime, whereas it's probably not the same for covid. But we shall see.
rrright but no vaccine will fix a country being incapable of distributing it. It'll get outsourced to Martin Shkreli because there is no justice in the world and then you'll need to get a loan to afford it and I won't ever be able to get it bc I don't have the credit for a $300,000 vaccine loan
they said the same thing about the tests & where I live they're $200 a pop.
Aus have dedicated public healthcare, and despite occasional Murdoch adjacents crying about freedom and the economy, most people adhere to mask rules and lockdowns.
Oh and the whole, pay people to stay indoors thing.
so weird that the very much foreseen recession bounced back pretty quickly once you support the lower classes. No idea... probably a coincidence...
i believe the states did most of the work, not the national government. iirc morrison was trying to get states to open their borders...
Yeah I don't know much about the states relationship with the federal government. I'd love to know how much tussle there was between the two. I know Morrison is money above all, unless it counters his ideology, in which case there is no limit to the 0's on the check!
What sort of cursed timeline is this when anyone praises the Australian government?
Yeah but the Neolib Ghouls here are sane and know how to maximise long-term grift. The US is just pointlessly cruel and spends money to do it.
For months, soon, or maybe years, most of the world will be open to the rest of the world...
Except that Americans and British will not be allowed in anywhere!
For good reasons of public health.
Sounds perfect, no more Americans here. If we could also keep American products and media out I'd die happy
we already have the tech to end climate change,
we really don't, you can't power our fleets of trucks with solar panels and batteries.
my dream is they run rails down the middle of all U.S. interstates and slowly ban cars from them. run solar panels down the sides of the old interstate pavement and connect to the grid. use electric drives and mix cargo and passengers. use smaller connecting engines to pick up cargo and passenger modules at major track "off ramps" and transport them to distribution centers and passenger hubs. localized electric cars, delivery trucks and buses (free and communal) for local driving and local delivery. people can still have their "freedom to travel" but like ten thousand times more efficiently.
It's a tough job, no doubt. Vienna or even London is probably not possible.
But cities like Sydney have Atlanta levels of Urban Sprawl and "Good-enough" public transport (ie. better than any US city save maybe New York).
My parents' mansion in Servants Entrance, CT, is 10 miles of rough terrain from any train station, how do you propose that I get there? Or to any exurb, for that matter.
Don't say "we're in overshoot; there's no way to provide the energy to move 3 billion people and their individual vehicles along 50 mile round trips every day" because I won't accept it.
We neeeeeeeeeeed a way to provide for our lifestyle
oh well I guess it's a shame that trucks aren't a technology that can be replaced with a greener option, too bad cross-country freight trucking is the only option :/ sucks that god took trains away from us in the flood but what can u do, guess its fossil fuel only for us bc British Petrol paid someone $400,000 to tell you you can't power the trucking fleet with solar panels
We're never going to have anything remotely sustainable with the number of trucks on the road that we have, and so on. No matyer how you power them, it's woefully inefficient amd a huge waste of energy. Degrowth is the only feasible category at this point, and we should welcome it rather than resisting it.
We can provide for people's needs without jetpacks or 5G.
You can name pretty much anything we produce industrially, and I can make a case that we can get along just fine with 50-90% less of it.
And we're already well past the point of ending Climate Change, unless you have CO2 scrubbing tech that is scalable in your back pocket.
vietnam & australia didn’t need the vaccine to do it, so whatever it is that caused the US to not be able to deal with the pandemic without the vaccine is also gonna make the US be unable to deal with the pandemic with the vaccine.
A causes B.
If B, then A.
Therefore, if C and not A, then not B.
Unassailable logic!
australia
Islands don't count unless it's Cuba. The only good performers are therefore exclusively Communist: Laos, Vietnam, PRC and Cuba
waiting for the ghost of albert einstein to solve your problems for you with a glass
If you look closer, ol' Albert is holding a magnifying glass to the words "We Need Socialism"
