have they seen which way the wind is blowing and recuperated accordingly? I don't get it
Nah, they think people like Sanders and AOC are actual communists.
Sanders has water downed Socialism so much that I remember some "progressives" were gleefully claiming that the US Military is an example of Socialism....
Yep, 'socialism' is no longer a useful term in many contexts.
Coming from a place of legitimately trying to be educated, how is the military not the closest thing in the US to socialism?
Workers are all provided the same wage based on their rank, location, marriage status, and number of children. Housing, food, healthcare, and education are all provided. There isn’t really private property unless we consider state-owned property to be private. If every job did that, wouldn’t we be a lot closer to socialism (or communism? I haven’t read enough theory to really know the difference, gulag for me)
In terms of what the military does, no that’s not remotely socialist, but as a work structure how far off is it?
They're not workers and they don't own the means of production. It is hierarchical and reactionary and not democratic in the slightest. They have no position of collective bargaining and they are ideologically opposed to it. Being "state owned" does not mean "socialist" in any way.
The military is a perfect example of social fascism, for the reasons you listed.
The points you bring up about collective bargaining and owning means of production help me see a lot of the difference. I hadn’t thought about something like social fascism existing.
I don’t think there’s anything good about what the military does, but it’s hard for me to not consider military people to be workers. If anything, I’d consider them more like class traitors akin to police. I’m talking about people lower down the chain, obviously Generals, people in leadership positions, etc are PMC or worse.
unless we consider state-owned property to be private
That's a big if. I'm fairly certain that the US uses its assets as collateral on investments, and most depts have investment arms. Then consider all the contracting that goes into maintaining that state property and the line really blurs.
Confuse people.
If people do not know what socialism is, they do not realise they must reject liberalism to be a socialist. This is why all of you should be out educating and teaching people.
I think the US has gotten battered by austerity from both parties so hard over the past four decades that anything other than austerity is seen as full communism.
Remember that most Americans have no idea what words mean. Especially words relating to politics.
gaslighting for the rubes and saps and marks, a dabbing display of dominance for those who get it
This isn't new it always happens.
American liberals respond to left criticism through unthinking denialism. They really can't process it outside of some ready-made talking points that amount to deflection like "purity tests". Their sentiment is always, "you should like what we like which is the same thing as being realistic".
This is example 53,869 of them saying, "look how great our monster is for you lefties!" only they're slightly farther up their own asses that they go and find examples of SuccDems actually giving him credit.
i thankfully haven't seen this too much, sounds like hell. i mean unless the word "progressive" now also means socialist. i know there is popular radlibs who are kinda implying he is super progressive when he is still decades and decades behind anything remotely "progressive"
It's cyclical
Potential leftist emerges
Push the moderate instead
Moderate wins through systemic support
Say the election is too important to criticize the moderate
Say we can push them left when it's safe
After winning, say they're the most left ever
Pretend that things are somehow different because you don't want a republican in office come the midterms
They believe it. Remember when Bernie Sanders extolled the virtues of Scandinavian Socialism? People saw that. That is their conception of what socialism is. Some of Biden's plans have a similarity to those countries.
