Please stop listening to rich kids.
Especially ones using fascist hashtags. https://t.co/mL53popBr4?amp=1
https://medium.com/@TalibKweli/why-ados-is-trash-receipts-attached-5a337f46f10
And working with Trump staffers.
https://imgur.com/a/lVxZ3ye
Who are also connected to said fascist hashtags.
These people are not leftists. They arent your friends.
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Here is a contra mod calling BJG and her podcast rich kid fascism. Which is hilariously ironic.. considering contra is that.
Every breadtube struggle session should begin and end with
"Stop watching Breadtube"(edit: or as @Spike said"Stop relying on Breadtube")They might have been useful at some point to some people, but they're just terminally online personalities who don't organize or promote relevant ideas.
Please call me out if you disagree, tbh I haven't watched more than two videos by any breadtuber, but from the drama that surrounds them and the general bad takes they promote, they don't seem very helpful or useful to anyone.
I would tweak it to "stop relying on breadtube". I think there will continue to be good videos made on certain topics, but these people are never going to be a role model or leader or anything else. They're just people that make videos.
Same goes for podcasters
Yeah, that's a more nuanced approach.
Maybe because leftists read a lot of theory, we hope that our modern day essayists (video or otherwise) are as timeless and valuable, but that could also lead a lot of us to rely on these people to develop our ideas for us. Probably due to the atomization of culture and community due to late capitalism that prevents us from engaging in the activities that helped shape the revolutionaries and theorists that we still go back to.
Breadtube is not a good substitute for organizing (union, political party, grassroots community org, book club, local leftist rifle assoc, etc)
Wait, y'all are actually serious about this whole reading theory stuff? :cat-confused:
Wait, y'all are actually serious about this whole watching youtube videos for theory stuff?
real talk though, I strongly recommend reading theory/history rather than just watching youtube video essays or listening to podcasts.
Obviously reading theory includes audiobooks, but having the text and being able to go about it at your own pace rather than being passively getting pushed along by someone else is still better for comprehension.
I definitely agree. My comment was meant more as a snarky reminder that the chapo collective is a whole lot more diverse in our journeys towards radical politics than people here seem to think. Demanding people cancel this or that breadtuber, or denouncing content creation (i.e. Propaganda) as not praxis is just... Kind of divorced from reality. Demanding ideological purity from fellow party members makes perfect sense. Getting shitty at strangers on the Internet, even when we call each other comrade?
Absolutely, hence why I changed it from "stop watching" to "stop relying on" as the other user suggested. Basically, yes, breadtube can be useful for getting people informed, but i think the hyperfocus on the drama surrounding them and being surprised when people leftists were relying on to be on the same level as the authors of theory, who were (often but not always) involved agitators and revolutionaries or organizers, disappoint them by being self-serving youtubers trying to massage an algorithm that relies on human labor to function (and thus benefit them) and not doing much beyond relying on said algorithm to get a platform to say things.
Like, cool if lefttube got you into leftist ideas and politics and actions, but to treat them as if they're infallible and then get upset when they're dumb is a waste of time imo.
Good point, but I'm not really seeing anyone on here arguing breadtubers are infallible. From where I'm standing it's mostly just chapos grandstanding about who's the only leftists around here. Which is cool as a running joke, and not so much when it turns into gatekeeping.
For the record, I don't follow breadtube beyond the videos, or what few of them grab my attention. I don't do twitter, and don't care about relationships, spats, infighting etc. I see them and the podcasters as general leftist propaganda. Some good, some bad, a lot of it dubiously effective. That's it. I don't know where y'all are getting the idea anyone around here is confusing this with organising a revolution.
Good take, anyone wanting to avoid brainworms should do this too
Cuckphilosophy is excellent. Anarchopac / Zoe Baker also delivers some of the most genuine intriguing insights into anarchist philosophy. Both seem to abstain from twitter drama and meta posting / purple lights aesthetic and focus on good thought provoking videos.
anarchopac is an actual theorist, rather than an influencer with a seemingly agreeable vocabulary.
oliver north?
I'm just fucking with y'all, i don't know any of these people or their names
No more contrapoints. Society has progressed beyond the need for contrapoints
So this mod whos most likely a descendant of a slave owner is calling BJG a fascist when she's done more to promote socialism and help the working class than the entire sub combined, Contra included. Their citation is This guy.
Working with Trump staffers? Proof: She follows them on instagram... Because she was a press secretary... Thats her job. Lets not forget Contra making an hour long video about her love for a fascist YouTuber or her videos promoting and defending people like Buck Angel.
an hour long video about her love for a fascist YouTuber
Don't know about this, which video?
Was that video not like... almost entirely about what a massive piece of shit he is?
Right, no one actually suspects Contra of supporting fascists, but she was flirting with the Golden One, however ironically, so her subreddit enforcers don't get to claim that anyone who ever was in the same realm as a fascist is themselves a fascist.
talib kweli nooo why you gotta be like this? just cancel all my childhood favs, damn
I am completely out of the loop on this and tbh it's much better that way
Contra employed a person who had the leader of the white nationalist movement in America on her show Richard spencer.
Oh I was just saying that this criticism is hypocritical coming from the contra subreddit, considering contras employees platform Actual white supremacists. Read the reply to me
This comment summarized nicely Why BJG is awesome
So this mod whos most likely a descendant of a slave owner is calling BJG a fascist when she’s done more to promote socialism and help the working class than the entire sub combined, Contra included. Their citation is https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-news/talib-kweli-faces-sexual-harassment-accusations-from-former-protege-res-629864/ https://pitchfork.com/news/talib-kweli-battles-ex-collaborator-res-in-court-on-twitter-over-sexual-harassment-claim/.
Working with Trump staffers? Proof: She follows them on instagram… Because she was a press secretary… Thats her job. Lets not forget Contra making an hour long video about her love for a fascist YouTuber or her videos promoting and defending people like Buck Ange
Here's the link to said comment by *removed externally hosted image* to avoid confusion
https://hexbear.net/post/40662/comment/345808
Go figure the libs on that sub would be huge fans of "guilty by association" reasoning
communismfascism is when you use hashtags, and the more hashtags you use the morecommunistfascist it is:brd: twitter is done for now
#ADOS = American Descendants of Slavery, in reference to Black Americans ... a known fascist slogan ((0))_((0))
well to be fair the person who started ADOS thing is a reactionary who runs a think tank of POC who are anti immigrant... its a whole mess but using the hashtag at face value i think can be forgiven if you aren't familiar with Antonio Moore or Yvette Carnell.
I've subsequently learned that as well! But using the hashtag just means you're trying to speak to the same Black audience that that crypto-Trump op is trying to speak to. Especially when Brie is clearly not pro-Trump or anti-voting - she's an active electoralist Democrat.
yeah totally agree, its an insane bad faith reach to conflate everyone who's every used ADOS as a tag with fascists
Not voting for fascists makes you a fascist. sounds about white
I was convinced ephrael is a teenager for a while. I thought: there's no way an adult could be that dumb. But sadly it seems ephrael really is just a pudding-brained reactionary, of which there are many on that sub.
Platformed Truscum buck angel and refused to apologize for it. Truscum writer theyrn Meyer wrote her scripts
Platformed Truscum buck angel and refused to apologize for it.
Made an 1 1/2h video explaning what she disagrees with and why she thinks that working with that person is still beneficial for the cause as a whole.
Truscum writer theyrn Meyer wrote her scripts
No idea who that is, but apparently they have been friends for a long time. What is your source on her writing her scripts? Based on my 2 minutes of research, it is not clear how much they have worked together beyond giving advice. And even if they did, why not? If you are friends with someone who has some stupid views, why would you not take advice that can be useful to you and your cause, and also help changing your friend's views?
You have some strange definitions of fascism. People you disagree with, especially when the points you disagree on are hardly left causes (like transgender issues), aren't all fascists.
the points you disagree on are hardly left causes (like transgender issues)
but have you considered: fuck you
Haven’t seen this latest video, but I still like contra despite some flaws/mistakes. That’s human. But her fan base is beyond awful, the sub is easily one of the worst places on left reddit.
Honestly never thought I would see someone say ADOS was a fascist term.
She made a 1 1/2 hour video where she strawmans her critics as anime nazis and that the only thing wrong with Buck Angel was a personal conflict 10+ years ago instead of actively supporting transphobia and fascism on Twitter, which she claims that she literally didn't even visit his twitter even though she was fully aware of his reputation among Nonbinary people. That video also caused people to get harrassed by her supporters in identical ways to Contra herself, which she implied caused her to feel suicidal and then brings onto others.
Theyrn Meyer has made collab videos with milo yianopolous Steven crowder Gavin the guy who founded proud boys Sargon of Akkad tim pool Richard spencer.All fascists. She’s a fascist.
Isn’t Richard Spencer pretty fash too? I know he wants to ‘remove’ all non whites from America.
Richard Spencer led the charolettesville neo nazis. Is also a white nationalist and believes black people and minorities should be expelled or executed tom the state. Stefan molyneux is a proponent of race realism. Was banned from multiple platforms for saying that minorities should be expelled and executed from America. Gavin started a neo nazi cult. Millenial woes is another white nationalist theyrn had on her channel. You don’t know what you are talking about. Any self identifying white nationalist is a fascist. All of these fucking people have been on her channel. Where she promotes them. And to say Steven crowder Sargon Lauren southern tim pool and more aren’t reactionary fascists is also ridiculous. You can downvote facts all you want. It’s not my problem. Candace Owens was also on her channel. She caused a mass shooting by a white supremacist last year. You guys are idiots to think theyrn Isint a piece of shit for agreeing with and platforming neo nazis
modern white nationalists absolutely do take advantage of the fact that capitalism is in decay. Spencer's whole shtick is that he was trying to get bourgeois funding for his white nationalist project. he failed at that project because he was aggressively deplatformed but I don't think failure disqualifies him as a fascist.
All western countries are still white supremacist. Richard spencer is a fascist. Gavin is a fascist. Stefan is a fascist. They are all right wing Faux populists who espouse a white ethnostate to fix societal decay. That is the definition of fascism. They all meet it. So uh can u stop.
set of circumstances that intentionally takes advantage of the fact that capitalism is in decay.
milo yianopolous Steven crowder Gavin the guy who founded proud boys Sargon of Akkad tim pool Richard spencer.All fascists. She’s a fascist.
To be fair, fascist doesn't really have a clear definition, as fascism doesn't really have a clear definition.
Fascist is a word with an actual definition that isn’t just “thing I don’t like.”.
Found the redditor
And ContraPoints has created content opposing those people. Do you see any fascist influences in her videos? Being friends with someone who has problematic views does not make you a fascist.
This was an employee of hers writing the scripts of her videos who has made collab videos with actual nazis such as Richard spencer and Stefan molyneux
This was an employee of hers writing the scripts of her videos
As I said, my research resulted in them being friends. Apparently she also does some editing and probably gives some advice here and there (https://web.archive.org/web/20190708020125if_/https://www.twitter.com/ContraPoints/status/1148028660491923458). If she does a good job at this, and helps spreading a more left message, isn't that good?
She has made videos with Literal neo nazis no she should not be an employee of any self respecting person. The fact that she made videos with white nationalists automatically should make her unemployable by contra. Also a white south african
I would hire my friends who have problematic views if they can do the job I need them for well. Gets them out of their bubble, helps my message, and makes them actively work on spreading a left message. Everyone wins in this case.
¯\(ツ)/¯
There’s a difference between being problematic and supporting a white ethnostate and being White from South Africa.
I know someone who used to believe that the Middle East should get nuked, except for Israel. He grew up in Israel. Does that count as bad enough?
He has since then improved and given up on most of his Islamophobia. There is still some damage caused by growing up surrounded by so much propaganda, but overall he has moved far to the left. Your approach would have been to call him names and isolate him, helping exactly 0 people.
Yes. It’s not any self respecting persons job to rehabilitate fascists. And openly employing people with fascistic views makes you suspect as well.
I guess I am basically a fascist because I have spent many days of my life arguing with them. I need to be more lazy and isolate people, then cry about them radicalising themselves.
I just don’t waste my valuable limited time on people who have reactionary world views. It’s not my problem
True, you are lazily living in your bubble and attack those reaching outside of it.
It’s not my obligation to rehabilitate fascists. Nor do I want too. It’s not my obligation to Rehabilitate abusers. It’s fucked up that u say it’s lazy to not want to interact with fascists. No. It’s for my own sanity
No. Grammar is performative and arbitrary. Also I’d like to point out I just showed you an employee of contra is a literal nazi and you just ignore it. Contra is a fascist by her actions and not her words. Also liberalism is thinly veiled fascism. She identifies as a liberal. It’s cringe that I have to tell people this.
Grammar is performative and arbitrary
Grammar has some simple rules that make reading and understanding much easier. Your fight against grammar is not helping you if you intent to communicate something.
Grammar is performative and arbitrary
No, if grammar was arbitrary it wouldn't exist. It exists to help break up sentences to help us comprehend them better. Humans find it difficult to read lots of information all at once without pauses.
Also how is 'performative' a criticism?
I’m not a contra stan so I’m not really concerned, liked some of her old videos. This Theryn person seems pretty bad though, I see people claiming she’s changed but seems like she’s got a lot to make up for.
She does seem like further evidence that the song ‘I’ve never met a nice [white] South African’ is pretty true.
Has videos supporting neo nazis that she deleted. I don’t think she deserves a second chance and esp not employment from a so called leftist
okay, but she's not getting anyone killed, so let's focus on the people actively doing fascism.
I'm not sure if Meyer works on all of her scripts but some of the drama posted in r/contrapoints had Contra mentioning that in the process of making the video, Meyer mentioned Buck Angel as somebody who was an old fogey trans activist and could be included in the video doing a like, 10 second voice clip.
I don’t really care about any of this, but it’s funny to see “please stop listening to rich kids” and Then citing Talib Kweli, who in addition to being a creep, is also a “rich kid” who grew up in Park Slope and went to prep school in Connecticut.
