https://nitter.net/comaccomacco/status/1708407389576200391
Yeah, but they teach us he was bad without explaining why he did what he did aside from a vague "He hated machines"
I was led to believe the luddites were like the Amish and they had like, a religious opposition to technology.
No, it was a targetted movement where they believed the technological advances were replacing good jobs with little benefit to the community. I don't know the details but I believe they accepted new technologies when it was displacing dangerous labour. I imagine it's not dissimilar to discussions we're having right now about more or less the same issues!
Yep, and they didn’t destroy machines belonging to owners who weren’t dicks. It was against using new tech to immiserate artisans, not against the new tech itself. It may have been bad tactics, but the motivations were good.
Apparently they just didn’t want their labor replaced with machines so they’d be out of the job, but the propaganda (“tHeY jUsT oPpOsE pRoGrEsS”) is the story that survived within the imperial core.
So there is actually a strong analogue here with actors and writers not wanting to be replaced with LLM chatbot or image-generative AIs. Adam actually is a Luddite, in a sense, and it seems weird to me that some cringelib is clamoring for something that will replace them as well, they just don’t know it yet.
luddites are reactionary according to marxbut what is happening here with the unions is seizing AI tech for the benefit of workers, not the corporations. the contract explicitly allows writers to use it as they wish, but cannot be pressured by corporations to use it to meet quotas. it is explicitly not luddite, and is in fact what marx suggests to do with emerging technologies. i fully expect writers to use ai to make their jobs easier going forward and to have something to bounce ideas on without having their jobs endangered.
I don’t think this is a fair assessment. from the quote Tachanka posted, Marx is just saying Luddism is bad tactics. Is there other info to say that Luddism is reactionary, or am I misunderstanding what you mean by reactionary?
Being a Luddite is my whole schtick, please tell me I can keep posting pictures of hammers (I have a lot of hammers)
well the luddites were by definition reactionary as they were acting in reaction to the advent of capitalism by resisting it and trying to maintain their feudal rights
they did however have a valid point about how they had a better deal under feudalism but I imagine that Marx was criticising them for not having the imagination to see that the machines would have been good if they were the owners of the machines and rather than fight the machines they should have took them
Ok, that makes sense to me. Of course, by the same logic, modern labor unions trying to claw back conditions they lost in the 80s are also reactionary, even while doing harm reduction and building labor power which might help in a future revolution.
I think of ‘reactionary’ as synonymous with ‘anti-communist’ but that’s only really the common connotation because of our context.
As long as I can keep posting 🔨
yeah I actually don't think reactionary is necessarily always bad.
reactionary is sometimes incorrectly used in place of counter-revolutionary
TL;DR We shouldn't destroy the machines, we should seize them from the ruling class.
the thing about the EU that no one likes to talk about is that Oswald Mosley came up with the idea first and he was a fascist.
I would be more forgiving of that fact except for everytime I get into an argument with an EU supporter they almost always end up more or less quoting Oswald Mosley
There's a bunch of people like that on Reddit who are convinced AI is taking over every industry and people trying to push back against AI techbros taking advantage are luddites afraid of change. Pretty sure those office workers will be the first to lose their jobs.
I kept using the term luddite for so long until I read about the actual luddites; it's crazy how relatable they are and yet they've been smeared so thoroughly.
That was kinda fun. I know just enough computer science to ask the questions that really annoy "AI"
accolades.
TL;DR We shouldn't destroy the machines, we should seize them from the ruling class.
which is smart and good and not ludditism. honestly I'm not even sure ludditism would be possible for them, unless they suddenly started blowing up random AWS server closets until they got the ones that happen to be generating screenplays
Sure, but our respect for Luddites is for who they are in their context. In the same way that the Jacobins are not how we should be, but they developed much of our theories for us and experimented in ways that gave us a better understanding
: "I'm not a primmie."
: "I am not a leftist!"
: "You both are literally the same because you care about stuff and it makes me uncomfortable to see someone give a shit about anything besides consooo-I mean, the economy."I was not accusing the writer's strike of doing otherwise. My comment was in response to the tweet in the screenshot which claimed socialists are luddites. The writer's strike was not luddite. Socialists are not luddites.
yes, and I would further add that some amount of destruction of means of production is inevitable in the process of waging class war, but it should not be the primary aim of class war
How's that post go again
If I have to get exposed to the political opinions of a 14 year old again, I'm going to scream?I remember when we first set up shop here and I realized there were actual teenagers amogus. I threw up in my mouth a little with the idea of talking to someone half my age without realizing it.
Good news is it's 3 years later and they've all likely grown into full people at this point.
Good news is it's 3 years later and
they're not mathematically half my age anymore
It's been really fun going from high school to drinking age on this site
"You shouldn't be allowed to moderate a website unless you can legally buy your own alcohol and down your sorrows in it"
sometimes I remember moderating subreddits when I was a teen, and I wonder why I did that.
I had fully grown adults getting so mad at me and beefing with me over the stupidest things when I was 16 on here lol
I do not remember believing anything particularly strongly when I was 14 o_O
I was an anti-religious dweeb due to conflating all religion with the fucked up evangelical churches my mom would drag me to and I had a copy of The Stranger that I would take every with me and try to be seen reading.
Like if I met an identical 14 year old I wouldn't think he was doomed to suck forever but I definitely wouldn't want to hear his thoughts.
the sad thing is that 14 year old was and is doing better than 90% of US voters
every 14 year old is going to believe something dumb because they only just started having their own opinions
I remembered some good sentiments, but with no correct way to enforce being supplied, and some stupid fascist programming I hadn't seen as such yet. Most of my takes were abysmal at that age, but I was at least highly feminist and had a strong but flawed anti-racism stance.
Idk, maybe a lot of mine were just suppressed or I had been so cowed that I just didn't have anything going on inside. Just agree with whoever you're talking to
I I've always been an opinionated, often contrarian ass. My evolution to leftist involved, I shit you not, Prager U ytps, because I found leftists dunked harder and better than anyone else.
That is a literal child. Like, it says 16 in their bio.
Synthesis: Children should be able to use a little bit of internet, as a treat.
If you're old enough to drive a tractor and ride a moped on public roads, you're old enough to get mildly dunked on by an obscure internet forum you'll never even hear of.
Sorry, I don't make the rules.
If you publish a public take on unions, you should be praised or bullied as an adult
pretty common - it's two components of "asl" which most
MSN-using millennials should recognise(age, sex, location)
yea, i remember that, can't say i've seen "a/s/l" used much since AIM stop being used. Also adding it to the location is pointless since you can show your birthyear on twitter, maybe just pick a different month day to avoid getting doxxed
the blue checks are all so mad because they would die to simply be hooked up to an AI powered slop hose that gives them a batman movie every day no matter its quality
EDIT: Sorry I meant Batgirl.
But does it give you the cancelled Catwoman?
You mean Batgirl? Or did I miss something else they made?
Oh yeah.... I actually wrote Batgirl and I was like....wait bat girl that doesn't sound right.... and I thought nah it was Catwoman.
But you are right. I will edit it.
I havent watched any superhero slop in ages, but I'd be so down to see Brendan Frasier as a villain
Is there anywhere to find that or is it lost forever?
I doubt is lost forever... but idk. It was "cancelled" for tax reasons I think so....if somebody rescues the movie later on and puts it on the streaming service... maybe it would be considered fraud or something... or they owe money because it ended up making money idk I am talking from my ass not the right guy to ask...
Another thing is of somebody leaks it... but if it hasn't happened already not sure if it would happen.
literally not luddite, the union contract permits writers to use AIs when it benefits themselves
They're 16 years old. It's perfectly natural to be a complete idiot when you're a child. I was a bog-standard libertarian at their age, there's still plenty of time to turn around.
Idk when I was 16 I was the normal sort of stupid 16 yos are, not this hilterlite trash
Yes but also it's in black and white in the Constitution:
"The right to consume treats shall not be infringed."
it says their location is "16 | Milan"
I dont think that's an age? unless people are putting their age next to their location and im just unaware.
A/S/L is such an ingrained thing to the internet I don't get how you think 16 is anything except age here.
A/S/L is such an ingrained thing to the internet
sure, maybe 20 years ago in an AIM chat room. Twitter lets you show a birth year so, unlike an AIM chat room, twitter has a mechanism to show age. that's why it made no sense or wouldn't stick out. should be age/pronoun/location in the bio, then it would still fit the format.
Love calling someone a Luddite while he made a video with a phone to post it on social media, very Luddite indeed
quaaludes enjoyers https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IG2JF0P4GFA
it was an anti industrialist movement in rural england. Basically what people who like the unabomber think the unabomber was
similar to how some people read paradise lost and think the devil is sympathetic without realising that Milton was also using the book as a vehicle to express his own radical opinions about the civil war - basically if you read paradise lost and found the anti-hierarchy stuff appealing you don't like the devil you like Oliver Cromwell
it was workers destroying the products of their own labor instead of seizing them from the bourgeoisie because pro-labor movements before Marx not yet developed an internally consistent theory of surplus value. it was also not anti-industrialist. It was simple flash-in-the-pan anger at technological unemployment. They were not opposed to technology in other areas of society outside their craft. So it was a form of craft consciousness, as Debs calls it, rather than class consciousness.
maybe but they did focus their destruction on the industrial machines. It wasn't a very organised movement and it didn't have a well thought out stance on things but it was an anti-industrial movement.
I really don't know how liberals can square the circle with their whole "we are the furthest left in this country and you need to vote for us to stop fascism" bullshit.
What even is fascism to them? They don't seem to care about anything other than when Trump did mean tweets.
Biden has given more money to the police after BLM, Biden has drilled more oil, he started a new war, ended COVID help, is still detaining and separating families at the border, union busting...
The list is long
Fascism is when you hurt marginalized people and gloat about it. Liberalism is when you hurt marginalized people and don't gloat about it. At least Biden isn't hurting the feelings of the people he puts in cages!
blue no matter who; it's harm reduction!
the luddites were worried that industrialisation would lower standards of living for the english lower classes. The industrial revolution then did that
To be clear I don't think the luddites were ambitious or organised enough but their belief that industrialisation would lower their standard of living was indisputible
The enormous destruction of machinery that occurred in the English manufacturing districts during the first 15 years of this century, chiefly caused by the employment of the power-loom, and known as the Luddite movement, gave the anti-Jacobin governments of a Sidmouth, a Castlereagh, and the like, a pretext for the most reactionary and forcible measures. It took both time and experience before the workpeople learnt to distinguish between machinery and its employment by capital, and to direct their attacks, not against the material instruments of production, but against the mode in which they are used.
WE'RE NOT LUDDITES!!!!! 
